{"id":23641,"date":"2015-03-05T07:38:44","date_gmt":"2015-03-05T06:38:44","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/sala_stampa\/archivionotizie\/comunicati\/2015\/03\/gentiloni-la-minaccia-del-terrorismo-2\/"},"modified":"2015-03-05T07:38:44","modified_gmt":"2015-03-05T06:38:44","slug":"gentiloni-la-minaccia-del-terrorismo","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/en\/sala_stampa\/archivionotizie\/interviste\/2015\/03\/gentiloni-la-minaccia-del-terrorismo\/","title":{"rendered":"\u201cThe threat of Islamic terrorism could lead to a united government\u201d (La Stampa)"},"content":{"rendered":"

\u201cDecisive meeting today in Morocco. The Ukrainian crisis? We need to place our bets on the ceasefire and the withdrawal of heavy weaponry\u201d.<\/em><\/p>\n

\u201cThere was no \u2018mess\u2019 over Palestine. The government has a balanced position, understood at the international level\u201d<\/em><\/p>\n

by Cesare Martinetti<\/p>\n

Just a few weeks to defuse the prospect of \u201ctotal war\u201d in Libya, as referred to recently at the United Nations, according to the \u201cbehind-the-scenes\u201d situation reconstructed yesterday by La Stampa. We\u2019re discussing this with Foreign Minister Paolo Gentiloni just a few minutes after his conversation with the mediator, Bernardino Le\u00f3n. Today, for the first time, all of the parties in the conflict will sit down together at the negotiating table. Also today, Prime Minister Matteo Renzi \u2013 the first Western leader to visit since the Nemzov murder \u2013 will be meeting Vladimir Putin at the Kremlin. Two interwoven and overlapping crises.<\/p>\n

Minister Gentiloni, what proposals will Le\u00f3n be bringing to the Libyans\u2019 table?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u201cHe\u2019ll propose a protocol of agreement concerning security and the formation of a government of national unity with a prime minister and two deputy premiers. Proposals and names will need to emerge from the meeting. The situation has become even more complicated, if that were possible. We have some grounds for hope in that the use of ISIS flags on what might be termed a \u2018franchise\u2019 basis, rather than any penetration from the outside, has, paradoxically, given new scope for the political process. Just a few weeks ago \u2013 when we were forced to close our embassy \u2013 it would have been unrealistic to imagine all parties in Libya sitting down together at the same table, as I hope will happen today in Morocco\u201d.<\/p>\n

But the West seems divided: some support Tripoli, others Tobruk. Why is that?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u201cNo, we\u2019re all starting from the same position: an acknowledgement that the Tobruk Parliament has its own democratic legitimacy, but does not control the entire country. That\u2019s why we\u2019re talking about national unity, so that the groups in southern and western Libya who don\u2019t identify with Tobruk can also be involved\u201d.<\/p>\n

According to yesterday\u2019s reconstruction in La Stampa, by Paolo Mastrolilli, the United Nations are evaluating a sea blockade to prevent trade in contraband oil and at the same time control the seas off Italy. What do you think about that?<\/p>\n

\u201cGood diplomatic practice is to discuss the alternative options only when the wager has been lost. Right now, the Italian government is working with the Libyans and the other countries with a role in this crisis, such as Egypt and Algeria, to ensure that Morocco produces a good outcome. We\u2019re not talking about \u201cplan B\u201d or fall-back options. Tomorrow [ed.\u2019s note: today] will see a crucial meeting\u201d.<\/p>\n

Are you confident that the UN can really take effective action, given that it\u2019s paralysed by the divisions in the Security Council?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u201cI\u2019ll answer that by paraphrasing Churchill\u2019s comment on democracy, which I recently heard a former Australian prime minister quote with regard to the UN: it\u2019s the worst system, except for all the others. And there\u2019s no alternative solution\u201d.<\/p>\n

Minister, you were in Tehran a few days ago, meeting President Rohani, Foreign Minister Zarif and other Iranian leaders, including Rafsanjani. What is Italy\u2019s role in the nuclear talks? We\u2019re not sitting at the official table.<\/p>\n

\u201cWe\u2019re trying to make a contribution to facilitate the negotiations, something that we\u2019re in a position to do, in close contact with the USA, thanks to our long-standing relations with Iran. We working for a positive agreement that would also have interesting \u2018side effects\u2019: to the campaign against ISIS and to an expansion of our export market. However, engaging Iran in monitoring its civil nuclear programme and building on its current more moderate stance is hugely important in itself, quite apart from terrorism and economic relations\u201d.<\/p>\n

What are the key reasons to believe in this agreement?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u201cLet me ask you<\/i> a question: is it in the West\u2019s interests to place its bets on Rohani and the people in Iran who are working on the negotiations, or to look back with nostalgia to Ahmadinejad? While I perfectly understand Netanyahu\u2019s motives and Israel\u2019s concerns, I think that Obama is right\u201d.<\/p>\n

Even at the cost of isolating the government in Jerusalem?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u201cWe\u2019re one week away from the elections and, even if concerns about Iran are real, in the eyes of public opinion in a great democracy like Israel, we need to look to the future. We mustn\u2019t make the mistake of halting a process that will lead either to a successful conclusion, with an improvement in the situation, or to a marked deterioration. We cannot return to the starting blocks \u2013 the situation is more difficult, and more dangerous, than it was 2 years ago\u201d.<\/p>\n

Italian foreign policy is often viewed as ambiguous and cunning, as shown by the mess over the recent parliamentary motion on Israel-Palestine. What is the government\u2019s position?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u201cI take the exact opposite view \u2013 there was no mess, but a balanced position by Italy, a position that is understood perfectly well at the international level and is in line with the European Parliament. That position, essentially, is to urge the government to recognise a Palestinian state and at the same time to kick-start negotiations by the parties concerned. If anyone can tell me of another way to achieve recognition for the Palestinian state, I take my hat off to them\u201d.<\/p>\n

But on the Ukrainian crisis, too, we\u2019ve given the impression that we\u2019re occupying the middle ground, and have attracted suspicions that we\u2019re too soft with Putin.<\/p>\n

\u201cIn diplomatic jargon we use the expression \u2018double-track\u2019. Which in our case has taken the form, firstly, of firmness with Russia. Italy has never shied away from sanctions, indeed I would add that we tend to apply them even more rigorously than other countries\u201d.<\/p>\n

Which ones?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u201cI won\u2019t say which. But we don\u2019t take lessons from anybody. At the same time, we\u2019ve always called for the road of dialogue with Russia to be kept open. Translated into the current situation, that means we must place our bets on this ceasefire, through which the heavy weaponry is being withdrawn. The road ahead is very complicated, but that doesn\u2019t mean that every time we meet we need to decide on new sanctions\u201d.<\/p>\n

But do you really think that this conflict can be resolved? Moscow views Ukraine as part of its history and system, and all of Putin\u2019s policy is designed to rebuild its old sphere of influence.<\/p>\n

\u201cI think that we shouldn\u2019t be looking to the narratives of the last century. Donbass isn\u2019t Sudetenland, and the present-day confrontation between NATO and Russia is not a new version of the cold war. Suffice to consider that the next NATO summit will take place in the building where the Warsaw Pact was signed. I don\u2019t know what Putin wants, I assume his aim is to exercise a decisive influence. We need to reassure our NATO allies, especially the Baltic countries, and defend Ukraine\u2019s territorial and economic integrity, without bringing it into NATO\u201d.<\/p>\n

Not even the European Union?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u201cUkraine has an association agreement with the EU, rather than accession in the near future. We need to impress upon Russia that we have no aggressive intent, but are utterly determined to defend the international rules. This mix of firmness and reassurance is the essence of the diplomatic efforts of Merkel, Hollande and Prime Minister Renzi, who\u2019s in Moscow right now\u201d.<\/p>\n

The murder of Boris Nemzov \u2013 whoever was responsible \u2013 tells us that democratic normality is still a far-off prospect. How many sacrifices of human lives can be accepted in diplomacy?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u201cContrary to our hopes in the 1990s, we are not living today in a calm and peaceful world. Today\u2019s world requires us to have relations with countries that do not respect rights to the same degree as we do. It\u2019s right to talk to Putin, as the \u2018Normandy format\u2019 leaders have been doing. But we need to reiterate at the same time that Italy is against the death penalty and promotes free expression, in Tehran as in Moscow\u201d.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"\u201cDecisive meeting today in Morocco. The Ukrainian crisis? We need to place our bets on the ceasefire and the withdrawal of heavy weaponry\u201d. \u201cThere was no \u2018mess\u2019 over Palestine. The government has a balanced position, understood at the international level\u201d by Cesare Martinetti Just a few weeks to defuse the prospect of \u201ctotal war\u201d in […]","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"","ping_status":"","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[23],"tags":[9,6,76,404],"class_list":["post-23641","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-interviste","tag-europa","tag-mediterraneo-e-medio-oriente","tag-ministri-precedenti","tag-sicurezza"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/23641","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=23641"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/23641\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=23641"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=23641"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.esteri.it\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=23641"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}