Rome – Italian Minister of Foreign Affairs Antonio Tajani has spent one of the most tense days out of the thousand since the start of the conflict between Russia and Ukraine in Warsaw. The so-called “Weimar format”, which comprises Poland, Germany and France, has for the first time been enlarged to include Italy, Spain and the United Kingdom as a way to prepare for the changes coming from the other side of the ocean.
Minister Tajani, Putin has responded to the presence of American missiles in Russia with new atomic threats. Are we in the midst of an escalation?
“This situation has one clear culprit – Vladimir Putin. Recent events, notably the appearance of North Korean troops on the scene in recent weeks, have constituted an escalation on the part of Russia, which the Americans are responding to.”
Italy, and yourself in particular, has always expressed opposition to the use of Western weapons in Russia. Yet, as of yesterday, this scenario has fully unfolded. Do you condemn these actions?
“I will not condemn the United States and Ukraine. I fully understand the actions they have taken in recent hours.”
Does a new scenario presuppose a change of line in Italian foreign policy?
“No, Italy is not changing its line. We supply weapons for defensive purposes, and we are close to Ukraine, but we are not at war with Russia. Our ‘policy’ is different from that of other countries.”
The summit in Warsaw with the Ministers of France, Germany, Great Britain, Spain, and Poland also addressed the issue of defence spending, reiterating the commitment to reaching and even exceeding 2% of GDP. Since such a goal is not within reach for Italy, what will the Italian government do?
“As we reiterated also in the Warsaw conclusions, it is necessary to decouple military investments from the Stability Pact. We will continue to take our request to Brussels.”
Another new development announced at yesterday’s summit was the plan to issue Eurobonds to finance a European defence plan. Is this a concrete idea?
“We will see how we get there. What needs stressing is that even countries that were once reluctant to engage in joint debt, such as Germany, now understand that it is a necessity.”
Is Putin stepping up his actions in the hope that Trump will soon open negotiations?
“I don’t think the US administration, even the new one, can be influenced by what Putin does.”
You really don’t fear that, with Trump in the White House, support for Ukraine might wane, leaving Italy and Europe in the lurch?
“I don’t think that is the case. Zelensky himself is optimistic that the war will end in 2025, and I agree with him. On the other hand, once the conflict is over, Ukraine will join NATO and begin its journey towards EU membership. In the meantime, we need a ‘just peace’, as John Paul II used to say.”
Speaking of Popes, do you also believe that a genocide might be taking place in Gaza, as Pope Francis says?
“He said that this will have to be evaluated. I do not believe that a genocide is taking place in Gaza, the legal prerequisites are just not there. This does not detract from the fact that we are very critical of the humanitarian consequences of the Israeli government’s actions. Too many civilians have died, and Hamas is equally responsible.”
Now that Trump is in the White House, will Netanyahu have even fewer limitations?
“I don’t expect anything new. The US has always supported Israel and will continue to do so.”
You cannot deny that the life stories of the future members of the Trump administration do not bode well.
“The citizens have voted. I am convinced that relations with the new administration will be good.”
In this context, would it not be suicidal to obstruct the start of the new European Commission?
“Absolutely. The Commission must begin operations on 1 December, and that is how it will be.”
Are you sure?
“Yes. In the past few days, I have had talks with everyone, including Ursula von der Leyen and Manfred Weber, and I am convinced that the vetoes have fallen, also thanks to President Mattarella’s intervention.”
Did you also discuss this with the Spanish Populars, who are stalling the appointment of Commissioner Teresa Ribera?
“The Socialists’ veto on Fitto was ideological, while the Spanish Popular Party wants to wait for Minister Ribera to give explanations in Parliament on the flooding in Valencia (the hearing is scheduled for today ed.). I understand their point of view, but you cannot stall the Commission.”
As Secretary of Forza Italia, you were the only one in the centre-right to celebrate the result of the regional elections, despite the victory of opposition candidates in Emilia-Romagna and Umbria.
“Yes, because we are now the second force in the coalition and the third largest party in the country.”
What does this mean for the government majority?
“I don’t want to blackmail the allies and I’m not the type to make overbearing demands. Nothing will change for the Italian government, but certainly our proposals on citizenship, taxes and pensions will have to be taken into serious consideration.”
What is the lesson that the centre-right must learn from the defeat in Umbria?
“That the candidates should not just be the result of partisanship. We must focus on the strongest personality, beyond party affiliations.”
Is this a way of saying that defeat would have been avoided with the former mayor of Perugia Romizi in place of Donatella Tesei?
“This is not for me to say. We ran the outgoing governor because it is the coalition rule. However, I note that Romizi is in first place in terms of preferences, in the whole of Umbria, of all parties.”
